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Sovereigns and "Persons"...

What law binds you? These are topics discussing the difference between statutory law and real law.

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Sovereigns and "Persons"...

Postby Nect4r$ » Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:52 pm

Ok, this may be obvious to some of you so bear with me.

I was led to post this out of a curiosity thats came up a few times regarding a pretty simple subject, that of "Sovereigns and 'Persons'... as related to travel". I know 'Persons' are fictions that are subject to "club rules", having given or being tricked into giving away their sovereignty to a lesser authority. But just what is the deal with Sovereigns traveling abroad? Does it relate to use of the "Person" or is there something else with passports being a forced aspect(as such have no consequences?) for travel within the game?

I know this may seem simple to some of you, yet it feels like the crux of a sticking point as it relates to being "in the game but not of it".

Any help with this appreciated :)
"2. "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all. [And after they have reigned they will rest.]" - Gospel of Thomas
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Re: Sovereigns and "Persons"...

Postby roage » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:41 pm

Nect4r$ wrote:Ok, this may be obvious to some of you so bear with me.

I was led to post this out of a curiosity thats came up a few times regarding a pretty simple subject, that of "Sovereigns and 'Persons'... as related to travel". I know 'Persons' are fictions that are subject to "club rules", having given or being tricked into giving away their sovereignty to a lesser authority. But just what is the deal with Sovereigns traveling abroad? Does it relate to use of the "Person" or is there something else with passports being a forced aspect(as such have no consequences?) for travel within the game?

I know this may seem simple to some of you, yet it feels like the crux of a sticking point as it relates to being "in the game but not of it".

Any help with this appreciated :)


I know here in the US our passports refer to "US Citizens" or "US National". One is a fiction and one is real.

Upon notification, you are technically ambassadors from the Kingdom Of God and eligible for diplomatic passport. A court filing should be all that is needed (Declaration of Sovereignty and Independence).

It would be worth a try. I know people who have done it here. The diplomatic passports relate to a sovereign by treaty with the Vatican I believe. We are beneficiaries of a trust and that allow them to relate it to those fictions to allow the crossover and remedy through law.
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Re: Sovereigns and "Persons"...

Postby Nect4r$ » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:56 am

Just checked and it says "BRITISH CITIZEN" on the one I have. Thanks for the lead on that, I'll look into it bit more and see how it relates here in the UK. Really are sneaky b______s aint they :evil:
"2. "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all. [And after they have reigned they will rest.]" - Gospel of Thomas
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Re: Sovereigns and "Persons"...

Postby roage » Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:00 pm

Nect4r$ wrote:Just checked and it says "BRITISH CITIZEN" on the one I have. Thanks for the lead on that, I'll look into it bit more and see how it relates here in the UK. Really are sneaky b______s aint they :evil:


Now the real questions is are they truly concerned with managing the fiction or managing the ignorant man?
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Re: Sovereigns and "Persons"...

Postby Nect4r$ » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:07 pm

roage wrote:
Nect4r$ wrote:Just checked and it says "BRITISH CITIZEN" on the one I have. Thanks for the lead on that, I'll look into it bit more and see how it relates here in the UK. Really are sneaky b______s aint they :evil:


Now the real questions is are they truly concerned with managing the fiction or managing the ignorant man?


I wont answer just yet, but two things jumped at me right away there as I read that -yet it doesnt seem as straight forward as it may at first(at least for now).

1. A realization I had last night while reading Tsarion's "Weapons of Mass Destruction Found"(or "The Constitution Con") article from the "Concepts in Law and Thought" thread.

2. A comment you made in video 7 of the Grail Presentation.

In point 1 above I always wondered why, other than some of their intillects(obviously some are quite thick), these guys(US politicians) could still pull of being of "Integrity" when K-tested. Well, how could they not; their fulfilling their responsibilities to the United States and not the United States of America, their doing everything they've contracted themselves to through oath. They are looking out for their own, people just dont realize just "who their own" are.

In point 2, in the presentation you state to paraphrase, cut the judges some slack, in most cases they succeed in being fair arbiters/they generally try to be neautral/(and most importantly)many of them will even welcome a man or woman who knows the Law.

I think this is actually how a practical miracle was pulled off the last time in an administrative court. No fine, 2 charges dropped. Even the Judge said "This is an exceptional if not unusual for this court, but in this instance... blah, blah, blah". Silence, shock and awe in the court room. That being said I think I was led to "bend fictions" in the letter I was inspired to write at 1am the night before the hearing. ;)

I cant say for definite right now, but my inclination is to guess that their more concerned with managing an ignorant man, since if ignorance is taken away the fictions cease to apply.

Going for a drive now, it'll give this some time to present itself to me more clearly.

As always lol, many thanks for the "look there, what is that?" :D
"2. "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all. [And after they have reigned they will rest.]" - Gospel of Thomas
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Re: Sovereigns and "Persons"...

Postby roage » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:02 pm

“In matters of experience: suffering succeeds where often conscience fails us.” Roage
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