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[Ruby Mavis]

I get it- so y do u speak of LOA in a negative when there is no good or bad? The whole idea is to learn from mistakes right? To learn about yourself? Reality is only what you make it, right?

[Ruby Mavis]

I am almost done- it seems repetative- which I don't mind. I want to remember that's why I keep checking in and doing a little more each time:) What does ego have to do with it? I am On- you r On- everything isOn. What we want is what will b given- we r given those desires 2 receive them or learn what it is we really desire? Again, I can't help using we- I mean all observers, everybody. I - letters r symbols. 2 me- never.... I have 3d memory- everything - words, symbols, #'s have sensory input attached - all senses and more than 5- haven't spent enough reading time to understand how u talk- just feel like Johnny 5 in Short Circuit- need more input. & changing, adapting faster 2 new thought patterns- sad - just asking.

[Ruby Mavis]

How do u tell the difference between u& the universe w/ out ego? W/ out leftside thinking? Is there any seperation? Am I who am I? Am I that Am I? Y can't the ego b destroyed??

[roage]

How do u tell the difference between u& the universe w/ out ego? W/ out leftside thinking?

Good question.

You may not know it yet but you have a more powerful sensory organ that is the thing that dragged you to this forum.

I do not need ego to think. Thoughts and solutions when required just appear without the inner babbling. The solutions that come often solve many problems including ones I am not conscious of.

Is there any seperation?

A Model Revisited will provide a constructive way to understand the difference:

http://www.roage.com/default.aspx?PageID=172

Remember it is just a model but it works.

Am I who am I? Am I that Am I? Y can't the ego b destroyed??

The ego is the mirror that Ø sees itself with. Without ego there would be no Universe and no mirror. However this mirror has a tendency to reshape and malformed the image and view it presents. Left unrestrained it cannot help but create suffering and pain as that was why it was designed. It is both our greatest enemy and can become our greatest friend but first it must be allowed under control. To destroy the ego is to die as an individual observational facet and we don't want that. It put the awareness into consciousness. However until it is put in its proper place it will warp your perception of everything.

As an enemy it is superb as it knows all your weaknesses and has no problem exploiting them. We learn little from friends but we are defined by our opposition and we have the best sparring partner ever conceived.

Thinking will never bring the purpose that intuition can provide and logic is only useful when it has purpose and only when first a proper foundation is laid. Logic without reason is a lesson in suffering.

Why waste time thinking about a problem that solves itself?

[roage]

I get it- so y do u speak of LOA in a negative when there is no good or bad? The whole idea is to learn from mistakes right? To learn about yourself? Reality is only what you make it, right?

No, I think I think LOA serves a great purpose in the same way that venereal disease teaches one about being more conscious of those we are with. One should try it and after a few years take a look at where it gets you. LOA is a re-packaged religious model based on the same basic underlying principles that do not bear up under cursory experimentation and observation. Not only that but the model will convince one that the many overpower the few and one and that one cannot remain protected from the mob of confused miscreants.

The whole idea is to learn from mistakes right? To learn about yourself?

Yes, but when one tries to fit their experience into the wrong model then the result cannot yield experience that can be relied upon to be predictable with any degree of certainty.

LOA also does not demonstrate the proper "self" as it is merely reshaping the ego into a potent, and loving agent with control and temperance when it is really not what one wants governing their experience. (See Religion)

Reality is only what you make it, right?

No, that is not accurate. Reality is produced by Ø for the benefit of Ø which in one aspect has split itself into countless conscious facets. The "reality" is not substantive and is more akin to a thought to produce the effect. The effect is Ego. Ego is the Universe suit your observer wears. Observer observes, nothing more. Ego deceives the observer into believing it has control. That control is an illusion. So if you are saying the world is what Ego makes it then that is wrong. Ego remains under the exclusive control of Ø. Since the observer has no control and merely observes then the true statement is:

Reality is what is made for us such that we are fooled into thinking it is made by us.

I do not move my finger. My finger is moved for me as it serves a purpose and only where it serves a purpose. Ego lies and tells my observer within that the observer is moving the finger by its will. It is a simple deception. When it is demonstrated that the flesh suits and everything around moves on it own then we can happily enjoy the ride. That is when things become a "trip".

[roage]

I am almost done- it seems repetative- which I don't mind. I want to remember that's why I keep checking in and doing a little more each time:)

What does ego have to do with it? I am On- you r On- everything isOn. What we want is what will b given- we r given those desires 2 receive them or learn what it is we really desire? Again, I can't help using we- I mean all observers, everybody. I - letters r symbols. 2 me- never.... I have 3d memory- everything - words, symbols, #'s have sensory input attached - all senses and more than 5- haven't spent enough reading time to understand how u talk- just feel like Johnny 5 in Short Circuit- need more input. & changing, adapting faster 2 new thought patterns- sad - just asking.

It is repetitive on purpose because there is a nuance that it points to that can only be grasped intuitively and not as a function of word definition.

What does ego have to do with it?

Most identify themselves as the Ego and when they do they succumb to the trick. We are not our ego.

I am On- you r On- everything isOn.

If one cannot distingush between the simulator and the observer then they are merely hypnotized by their experience and are held within Ego's ruse.

Taken one way it is correct but taken as most understand it it is not correct. Learning the difference is not a simple task.

What we want is what will b given- we r given those desires 2 receive them or learn what it is we really desire?

This is textbook ego expression. "What we want" means truly "What Ego wants"

"... is what will b given" --> "is what ego will give us"

"we r given those desires" --> "Ego is given those desires"

"what it is we really desire" --> "What it is that Ego desires"

You are not your ego and when you get that then you will take a great step, in that, your experience will produce for the observer within you only what you the observer truly needs.

This distinction makes the difference between beating your head against a wall to learn not to beat your head against the wall and not hitting your head against the wall in the first place.

I know it seems like what I describe as not being much fun. It isn't until ego is under control. When it is under control the things that almost magically occur like clockwork all on their own is a series of surprises that never ceases to entertain.

They manifest on their own with not egoistic wanting, desire or effort. It just is.

Does that help?

[Seamus]

What does ego have to do with it?

Most identify themselves as the Ego and when they do they succumb to the trick. We are not our ego.

My favorite treatment of this so far is the argument Jake Green has with himself in the elevator in "Revolver". BE SURE TO SEE THE US VERSION (Possibly called "Director's Cut" in the UK)

[Ruby Mavis]

Thanku 4 ur explanation it clarifies the very slow process- well 4 me anyways- that I'm going thru. I need it 2 b slow bcause I want 2 b as clear as possible 4 ø though I found- just now how 2 do that on my found by hitting s& seeing § & ß- more 8's? I try not 2 get lost in code- I enjoy the almost infinite conclusions& ideas that can b come out- I'm still observing 2 decipher. Like what happened last night- my passenger side door window fell off it's mechanism 2 put back up& I had signs of this happening all day& b4- cause all part of something bigger I keep receiving,recalling"reloading in my life's lessons- & my droid keeps acting strange. Anyways. Have had issues w/ back passenger window- but it's been manageable. I have 2 take care of business- will finish later.

[roage]

Thanku 4 ur explanation it clarifies the very slow process- well 4 me anyways- that I'm going thru. I need it 2 b slow bcause I want 2 b as clear as possible 4 ø though I found- just now how 2 do that on my found by hitting s& seeing § & ß- more 8's? I try not 2 get lost in code- I enjoy the almost infinite conclusions& ideas that can b come out- I'm still observing 2 decipher. Like what happened last night- my passenger side door window fell off it's mechanism 2 put back up& I had signs of this happening all day& b4- cause all part of something bigger I keep receiving,recalling"reloading in my life's lessons- & my droid keeps acting strange. Anyways. Have had issues w/ back passenger window- but it's been manageable. I have 2 take care of business- will finish later.

The fastest way of going through the process is knowing the law.

[Ruby Mavis]

Yes- but reading words& following them, as much as I might understand, does not bring about true knowledge. It is the practice& the homework that does as u well know. I know the price of a lie very well. I understand contract- I'm a woman, all relationships r contracts. I'm doing what I need 2 do 2 let go of ego- I need mistakes I've been 2 afraid most of my life of failure& success 2 risk anything. I did not realize completely y I could not stop posting or communicate 2 everyone,til I wrote this.My ego will never b gone- all I can do is listen & watch while I I make the mistakes I need 2 make. I was never in financial crisis b4, I nerved had 1 night stands or attitude problems@ work- I was the teacher's pet, the science teachers daugter, the lucky woman, the good girl, the smoking nun who could.care less bout the world cept what I couldn't stop dreaming of.I have 2 talk 2 learn, feel frustrated@ my lack of communication& learn not 2 b a victim because I'm afraid of living. I want 2 b more than a person- the cautious old lady bit has 2 go. I'm like dogs anyways;) Thanku 4 ur patience w/ my necessary learning process- I mean no disrespect- I'm tired of d-ying, I need 2 bang.